In Game: at Richmond

[quickcat]

Kenpom's main measure is points per possession. The 61st ranking I referred to (59th now!) is adjusted for the offensive efficiency of our opponents, but is not that much different from the raw rating. He is showing the Cats at 1.006 points allowed per possession, which is 75th in the country. On offense, he's got us at 1.043, which is 200th in the country.

If I'm guessing right you're looking at Team Rankings, which shows offense at 1.066 and defense at 1.028. That's the same ratio as the kenpom stats, so it would appear that the difference is the number of possessions being counted. But for other teams I'm seeing TR efficiencies lower than kp, so the rankings are going to be a lot different.

I have no idea what is right. But from listening to the coaches talk about stats and rankings, I know they rely on kenpom.

[bagelcat]

I watched the replay tonight.
I was there so you miss a lot. I wanted to look at some of the calls that had us irked.

Some observations:

We got a beneficial call early in the 2d when Bigelow had inside position but was called for a foul on a rebound vs. Reed.

After that, and late in the game.

Quinn uses Connor as fulcrum to go over Connor's back and knock the ball off Connor and out of bounds. Obvious foul.
Brizzi makes a clean steal v. Quinn and gets called for a foul
With about four-minutes left, Reed drives on Quinn and is met with a body shiver. No foul.
And lastly, King's outstretched foot is run into by Grant. That should NOT have been a foul. Esp. with 2.7 seconds left in a tie game. Show some judgment and don't decide the game, Mr. Official.

On the Kochera charge, I think they got it right. I thought Connor forced the contact there without an opening. I recognize some of you might disagree.

REGARDLESS, WE GOT SCREWED. It was very disheartening to watch. We played hard, and we played pretty well outside of another less than optimal three point shooting night. The defense was solid. We outrebounded them. And we lost.

.This entire conference season has been Kafkaesque, even though I'm not sure exactly what that means. We've lost 6 one possession conf games, two of which we had seeming control of in the last minute. If we even go 2-4 in those games this season has a very different feel. I would take 7-7 in conf play.

And lastly, could the broadcast team have been bigger homers?

[stevelee]

[Ursa Midmajor]

I don't know how Kenpom ratings work. I looked at traditional OER and DER, which is a points per possession metric. I'd be interested to know how Kenpom is calculated.

Because our possessions are pretty long, defensive points per possession may be higher just because there are fewer possessions for each team. That might help reconcile the two approaches.

[stan]

Grant goes brain dead. Again.

No excuse. Can't make that play. Just can't.

The play was legal so not sure why you “can’t make that play.” Hand to hand contact is legal. King kicked his leg out, which is an offensive foul, if anything is to be called. And if Grant hadn’t closed out hard and king makes the shot, you’d have been the first to call out the “lack of effort” or “have to be in the shooter’s face.”

So what is the play he can make other than to not get called for a foul he didn’t commit?

It's just typical Stan. Come on the messageboard for the season, be super negative about every play and pretend he is super coach. We see it every year.

Like it or not, Stan is right. Bad play by Grant, great play by King. It was a foul.

Haters gonna hate. Hatred turns brains to crap.

I don't mind the idiots and the ignorant. They make life interesting.

You don't leave your feet in defending that. You don't give them a chance to make that call. Period.

And it was the SECOND foul of the game Grant had on a three point shooter. Can't do it. Cannot do it. Just CAN NOT freaking do it. And everyone here who isn't brain dead freaking stupid knows it. You don't foul a jump shooter and you sure as hell never foul a shooter from three. If that's controversial, some people need to learn enough basketball to play with sixth graders in church league.

[bagelcat]

Agree you should never foul a three point shooter and you need to close under control.

In Grant's defense, the game was tied and he had to be aware that King could go around him. So he couldn't play right up on him.

I think it is legit to question whether it was a foul, and in fact after looking at it many times I don't think it was. It looked to me like Grant ran into King's outstretched leg, which wouldn't be his natural "landing spot"...

Although some would disagree, I don't think you make the same call with two seconds to play that you might make in the first half. Let the players decide the damn game.

[cat44]

Usually I agree with Stan. Thiis time he is full of it. Too much sauce?

[stevelee]

In my observation, very many times when a 3-point shooter is fouled, contract comes after the ball has left the shooter’s hand, sometimes somewhat later. What is the point of that? Is it just that in the rush to defend, momentum takes over?

[otherwildcat]

In my observation, very many times when a 3-point shooter is fouled, contract comes after the ball has left the shooter’s hand, sometimes somewhat later. What is the point of that? Is it just that in the rush to defend, momentum takes over?

Momentum is the primary factor. But many calls are subjective, for example the shooter sticking his leg out after the shot and contact is made. Who receives the foul in that case, the shooter or the defender?
Also, the dispartity berween officiating. Some conferences allow more contact. From my observation, the A-10 allows less contact compared to the BE. For example, Kolek from Marquette, was already bleeding above the eye from a scratch and no call, proceeded down court, made a three, and was flattened by the defender after the shot, again no call.

[JerseyLawyer]

That was a James Harden leg kick. Supposed to be a foul on the shooter. Horrible call.

[MikeMaloy15]

In my observation, very many times when a 3-point shooter is fouled, contract comes after the ball has left the shooter’s hand, sometimes somewhat later. What is the point of that? Is it just that in the rush to defend, momentum takes over?

Momentum is the primary factor. But many calls are subjective, for example the shooter sticking his leg out after the shot and contact is made. Who receives the foul in that case, the shooter or the defender?
Also, the dispartity berween officiating. Some conferences allow more contact. From my observation, the A-10 allows less contact compared to the BE. For example, Kolek from Marquette, was already bleeding above the eye from a scratch and no call, proceeded down court, made a three, and was flattened by the defender after the shot, again no call.

Haha, the NFL allows less contact than the Big East.

[stevelee]

In my observation, very many times when a 3-point shooter is fouled, contract comes after the ball has left the shooter’s hand, sometimes somewhat later. What is the point of that? Is it just that in the rush to defend, momentum takes over?

Momentum is the primary factor. But many calls are subjective, for example the shooter sticking his leg out after the shot and contact is made. Who receives the foul in that case, the shooter or the defender?
Also, the dispartity berween officiating. Some conferences allow more contact. From my observation, the A-10 allows less contact compared to the BE. For example, Kolek from Marquette, was already bleeding above the eye from a scratch and no call, proceeded down court, made a three, and was flattened by the defender after the shot, again no call.

So if you are taking an iffy 3, such as desperation at the end of the clock, it is a good idea to stick out your leg to make contact after the shot, since odds are if anything is called you get some free throws.

[DC69Wildcat]

Just throwing this out there to add fuel to the fire.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/pljz9t19 ... wuko3&dl=0